IAM1518 – Author Educates Company Leaders on Establishing Cybersecurity Defense Systems
Podcast Interview with Tom Kirkham
Tom Kirkham, founder and CEO of IronTech Security provides cybersecurity defense systems and focuses on educating and encouraging organizations to establish a security-first environment with cybersecurity training programs for all workers to prevent successful attacks. Kirkham brings more than three decades of software design, network administration, computer security, and cybersecurity knowledge to organizations around the country.
Recently published a new book entitled: Cyber Pandemic Survival Guide.
- CEO Story: When Tom was on the ISIS kill list because of his hack, that changed his life dramatically. It definitely increased his passion for cybersecurity, taking in a philosophical approach to strategy, management, leadership, HR, vendor relationships, etc. Recently published a new book and has great positive feedback.
- Business Service: Manage services provider – an outsource IT staff for small to medium businesses. His new book is to know what you need to do to buy the best-of-breed tools, implement administrative controls, and cybersecurity awareness training.
- Secret Sauce: Simplifying tools and implementation. Periodic business reviews explaining to clients and prospects and updates.
- CEO Hack: Setting the culture. Address to the team whatever goal or objective is missing in the company.
- CEO Nugget: If everyone does not share your vision, no amount of commanding is going to make it a successful launch. Everyone should swim in the same direction.
- CEO Defined: Set the vision and the overall strategy. Risk taker. Imagination and creativity. Servant leadership.
Website: irontechsecurity.com , tomkirkham.com
LinkedIn: irontech
Facebook: irontechsec
Twitter: IronTechSec
Youtube: IronTech
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Transcription
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00:27 – Intro
Do you want to learn effective ways to build relationships, generate sales, and grow your business from successful entrepreneurs, startups, and CEOs without listening to a long, long, long interview? If so, you've come to the right place. Gresham Harkness values your time and is ready to share with you precisely the information you're in search of. This is the I AM CEO podcast.
00:54 – Gresham Harkless
Hello. Hello. Hello. This is Gresh from the I AM CEO podcast. I have a very special guest back on the show. I have Tom Kirkham of Iron Tech Security. Tom, super excited to have you back on the show.
01:05 – Tom Kirkham
Yeah, thanks for having me back. Always enjoyed it.
01:08 – Gresham Harkless
Yes, definitely enjoyed it. And there are so many great things that you're working on and so many kinds of tools and tips and tidbits and even stories that you have that I'm excited to have you back on the show. But of course, before we jumped into that, we wanted to read a little bit more about Tom so you could hear a little bit more about him and all the awesome things he's doing. Tom is the founder and CEO of Iron Tech Security.
He provides cybersecurity defense systems and focuses on educating and encouraging organizations to establish a security-first environment with cybersecurity training programs for all workers to prevent successful attacks. Tom brings more than 3 decades of software design, network administration, computer security, and cybersecurity knowledge to organizations around the country. Tom recently published a new book titled The Cyber Pandemic Survival Guide, protecting yourself from the coming worldwide cyber war. Tom, again, excited to have you back on the show, my friend. Are you ready to speak to the I AM CEO community?
[restrict paid=”true”]
02:00 – Tom Kirkham
Yes, let's do it.
02:01 – Gresham Harkless
Let's make it happen. So I wanted it to rewind the clock here a little bit more since you last been on the episode Can you take us through a little bit more on what you've been working on? What's your CEO story is and what that you get started about awesome work you know?
02:12 – Tom Kirkham
Well, the big project was getting the book wrapped up and finding a publisher and all of the things that go along with that. So we released it, gosh, officially July 29th and it was on the Amazon. It was the number one new release for about 3 or 4 weeks. Got a lot of great positive feedback on it. And if you're a member of Kindle Unlimited, you can actually read it for free on your Kindle if you're in that subscription. But there's a paperback and an e-book version as well, all on Amazon.
02:52 – Gresham Harkless
Nice. I definitely appreciate you being able to kind of, you know, first of all, congratulations, but definitely love that you get able to kind of package all that information. July 29th is my mom's birthday, so that's a very special day in many ways. Now I have another one to add on. But I love that you've been able to kind of give so much information and kind of package it into the book. So I would love to hear a little bit more about what you do, but also want to hear definitely more about what we can find in the book so that we can of course pick it up.
03:17 – Tom Kirkham
For those of you who don't know about Kirkham Iron Tech or Iron Tech Security, we have 2 divisions. One of them, which is the 20-plus-year-old part of it, is what's known in the business as a managed services provider, right? It's basically an outsourced IT staff for small to medium-sized businesses. And actually we're getting larger and larger businesses all the time because not only is it very cost-effective to outsource your IT, even if you've got hundreds of people, a good MSP is going to have very, very expensive tools to properly manage that environment. So, you know, it's really great if you've got just a couple of IT people, but you've got 500 people to support, you'll see those environments outsource a lot.
And those IT people just are there kind of as a symphony conductor, you know, Whether they're outsourcing help desk or cyber security now Iron tech Security is a managed security services provider Much the same thing but the focus is completely on providing enterprise-grade cyber security defenses and training and the pen testing, vulnerability assessments and all of that.
So you, you, you can get your company, you understand where your company is today and what you need to do to really ramp up the protection for, you know, really all the stakeholders in the company. You know, it could be your clients or customers, but it's also your employees. For many of you, it could be your community, your state, you know. There are a lot of different moving pieces there and making your company and yourself safe is critical to the longevity of the company. I wanted to write the book not for my peers or other InfoSec specialists, but for that small business owner or medium-sized business president, CEO, or whatever and put it in real-world terms, and I figured the best way to do that was to wrap a fictional story around it.
But what I'm really proud of in the book is it does a really good job of illustrating the failure in management and leadership that led to the entire attack. And that's usually what it is. And I hate to say it like that, but hoping it doesn't happen to you or your company is not a strategy. And good leaders always have a strategy. They understand their risk. It's like buying insurance, Many businesses have liability insurance, errors and omissions, medical malpractice insurance, and on and on and on.
Of course, you got building and everything else. But that just seems like just a normal business management decision. You know, you're being prudent. If the worst thing happens, at least insurance will help make us whole. But the vast majority of small business people don't know where to go to get the best cyber security stuff and you really should go to a specialist and it is outside the scope of IT. Yeah, it's a different skill set, it's a different experience, and It's actually a different objective. My goal is to not make everyone who reads it a cybersecurity expert.
The point of the book, when you're the leader of the organization, is getting a high enough level view to know what you need to do, you know, to buy the best-of-breed tools to implement best-of-breed administrative controls or procedures and policies around password complexity requirements and putting in cybersecurity awareness training and then you're fulfilling your obligation to be a leader in the company. But the key critical thing to it is just impressing upon people the sheer depth of the problem. These are all industry standards. It's not just me saying you need to put these things in place.
The White House says it's part of the NIST cybersecurity framework, National Institute of Standards and Technologies. Those of us in the business understand that these are just best practices. And it's the cost of doing business these days. So by me writing the book and coming on your podcast and speaking engagements and things like that, My role is to educate as many people as I possibly can.
08:06 – Gresham Harkless
I definitely appreciate you obviously coming on the show, but definitely all the work that you did. I love that you were able to kind of arm the people with that information. So would you think that, I call it the secret sauce, the thing you feel either sets you or the organization apart and makes it unique? Is it your ability? And I'm thinking of like ASAP's fables of being able to kind of take sometimes, you know, those lessons, those tools, that information to be able to kind of simplify so that everybody can understand. Do you feel like that's something that, definitely in this book, but other aspects of things that you do, do you feel like that's what sets you apart and makes you unique?
08:39 – Tom Kirkham
Yeah, absolutely. We frequently, almost constantly, walk into a prospect, a new environment, or even existing clients, because we do periodic business reviews not only does technology change, but cybersecurity changes more and faster and there could be a new threat this afternoon that's a new threat actor and all of that. But in these meetings with prospects and clients, our job is to explain it in such a manner that they can understand. And okay, this isn't going to be, I get why we need it now, or I get how it's gonna be implemented. I understand the impacts on the business and what risk we're shrinking down, right? You always wanna minimize risk to the organization.
And if we just went in there, or if I had done this with the book, and it was just a dry technical discussion of implementing these technical controls, these administrative controls, and these physical controls, and talk about the benefits and all of that, it wouldn't have been as nearly as effective and it really wouldn't have, well it certainly wouldn't have illustrated the management and leadership component of it as well to impress upon them the need to make this positive decision for their organization.
10:07 – Gresham Harkless
Yeah, absolutely. And you start to see when you do and are creating leaders, I always feel like the best leaders are at that ability to not just say do what I say, but actually help to empower and help people to understand. As you mentioned that capital, that stakeholder capitalism is huge because there are so many people that are involved and you have to be able to empower leaders to be able to think about all the different things that are going on within an organization.
So I think that's huge. And that might be like your CEO nugget. Do you have a CEO hack, which is a little bit more like something from your book, or could be something that you feel makes you more effective and efficient that we can kind of take away from your book?
10:45 – Tom Kirkham
Your role and your responsibility is to set the vision and the overall strategy, understand, oh, there's a market opportunity here, is to investigate it. And one of the things that I do is when I am truly confident that we're breaking into a new market. And it's something no one else is doing. It's unique, it's risky. You gotta be a risk-taker, or else you're not going to be a good leader, right? Imagination, and creativity are all part of it. You know, a lot of business owners are technicians, you know, they were accountants who worked for an accounting firm and then decided to hang their shingle out.
Well, now that all of a sudden you've got to start wearing different hats and you've got, one of those is to look at the overall strategy. What are, What's going to be coming down the road 5 years down the road? If everyone doesn't share your vision, no amount of commanding is going to make it a successful launch into a new endeavor. You know, everyone's not swimming in the same direction or flying in the same formation. I guess that's a nugget. But, yeah, yeah. I think that, and it all works together with servant leadership and all of that.
12:00 – Gresham Harkless
Absolutely. I think you really are able to drill down deep and understand what success and winning mean for each individual person and be able to kind of dial in so that that ties into the overall vision that you have.
12:12 – Tom Kirkham
The real key is that is this somebody that everyone in the organization is going to enjoy working with and it's going to make everyone better at their job and their personal lives and their professional lives you know and if you if you're running a business and there's a lot of drama around the office you need to question what kind of culture are you setting? You know, that's the, I would say in my belief that that's, that's not a very productive environment and you're costing your company a lot of money.
12:44 – Gresham Harkless
Yeah, absolutely. And I think that I, I love that you said that because I think sometimes when you're thinking I'm bringing on the summer interns, so it's going to be for a few months and then they're going to be gone, and go back to school, whatever it might be. But I think if you start to look at that force multiplier, for lack of a better term, you start to see the impact that that person, whether it be the intern, whether it be the new person that's going to handle accounts or whatever that title might be, at the end of the day, that impact, just like we talked about from a cybersecurity standpoint, is going to carry on, not just from that 3 months, it's going to carry on and on and on. So you have to be so aware and I think very diligent about who you're bringing into that culture because it will stay with that culture beyond sometimes even when that person's there.
13:27 -Tom Kirkham
Yeah, absolutely. And sometimes they come in as an intern and they think they want to do something else, maybe with a publicly traded company, you know, be a small fish in a big pond or whatever the stability, so to speak, whatever that means these days. And then they discover that not only do they really enjoy certain aspects of our company, but then they go, I want to do professional development here and contribute to the culture because I really enjoy working here. It's not unusual for a Fortune 500 company here in town to pick up somebody and hire them away from us and then 2 or 3 years later, they come back to us.
And there's one in particularly local that it seems like it's like a door going there and a door coming back. In fact, the first time I hired somebody from them was over 30 years ago, and he works for us today. So it's just a really interesting deal. But I'm happy for them. If that's part of their goals in life, it doesn't change our relationship. It impacts us when they leave, but that happens. That happens in life. My objective is to make sure that we do everything we can as a company to address whatever goal or objective, whatever they're missing in our company, is there something we can do about that?
15:09 – Gresham Harkless
You know? Tom, truly appreciate that definition and perspective. And of course, I appreciate your time even more. So what I wanted to do now is pass you the mic, so to speak, just to see if there's anything additional that you can let our readers and listeners know. And of course, how best people can get a copy of the book, and find out about all the awesome things you and your team are working on as well.
15:26 -Tom Kirkham
It's on Amazon. You can search my name or cyber pandemic, and it'll take you right to it. You can find me on LinkedIn and all that stuff. But my, company is irontechsecurity.com. I have a website where, you know, it's tomcurcom.com where we promote the book and speaking engagements. If anyone's interested in having me speak in front of their organization, just reach out with that and we can see what we can do for you. Same thing with webinars. You know, if you're part of a society or, you know, we deal with engineering societies, accounting societies, bar associations. Nice.
16:05 – Gresham Harkless
I absolutely love that. Of course, we're going to have the links and information to show notes so that everybody can reach out and connect with you. Of course, get a copy of the book as well too. And I hope you have a phenomenal rest of the day.
16:14 – Tom Kirkham
Alrighty. Thank you very much. And it was my pleasure being here. Really is.
16:18 – Outro
Thank you for listening to the I AM CEO Podcast powered by Blue 16 Media. Tune in next time and visit us at iamceo.co I AM CEO is not just a phrase, it's a community. Be sure to follow us on social media and subscribe to our podcast on iTunes Google Play and everywhere you listen to podcasts, SUBSCRIBE, and leave us a five-star rating grab CEO gear at www.ceogear.co. This has been the I AM CEO Podcast with Gresham Harkless. Thank you for listening.
00:27 - Intro
Do you want to learn effective ways to build relationships, generate sales, and grow your business from successful entrepreneurs, startups, and CEOs without listening to a long, long, long interview? If so, you've come to the right place. Gresham Harkness values your time and is ready to share with you precisely the information you're in search of. This is the I AM CEO podcast.
00:54 - Gresham Harkless
Hello. Hello. Hello. This is Gresh from the I AM CEO podcast. I have a very special guest back on the show. I have Tom Kirkham of Iron Tech Security. Tom, super excited to have you back on the show.
01:05 - Tom Kirkham
Yeah, thanks for having me back. Always enjoyed it.
01:08 - Gresham Harkless
Yes, definitely enjoyed it. And there are so many great things that you're working on and so many kinds of tools and tips and tidbits and even stories that you have that I'm excited to have you back on the show. But of course, before we jumped into that, we wanted to read a little bit more about Tom so you could hear a little bit more about him and all the awesome things he's doing. Tom is the founder and CEO of Iron Tech Security.
He provides cybersecurity defense systems and focuses on educating and encouraging organizations to establish a security-first environment with cybersecurity training programs for all workers to prevent successful attacks. Tom brings more than 3 decades of software design, network administration, computer security, and cybersecurity knowledge to organizations around the country. Tom recently published a new book titled The Cyber Pandemic Survival Guide, protecting yourself from the coming worldwide cyber war. Tom, again, excited to have you back on the show, my friend. Are you ready to speak to the I AM CEO community?
02:00 - Tom Kirkham
Yes, let's do it.
02:01 - Gresham Harkless
Let's make it happen. So I wanted it to rewind the clock here a little bit more since you last been on the episode Can you take us through a little bit more on what you've been working on? What's your CEO story is and what that you get started about awesome work you know?
02:12 - Tom Kirkham
Well, the big project was getting the book wrapped up and finding a publisher and all of the things that go along with that. So we released it, gosh, officially July 29th and it was on the Amazon. It was the number one new release for about 3 or 4 weeks. Got a lot of great positive feedback on it. And if you're a member of Kindle Unlimited, you can actually read it for free on your Kindle if you're in that subscription. But there's a paperback and an e-book version as well, all on Amazon.
02:52 - Gresham Harkless
Nice. I definitely appreciate you being able to kind of, you know, first of all, congratulations, but definitely love that you get able to kind of package all that information. July 29th is my mom's birthday, so that's a very special day in many ways. Now I have another one to add on. But I love that you've been able to kind of give so much information and kind of package it into the book. So I would love to hear a little bit more about what you do, but also want to hear definitely more about what we can find in the book so that we can of course pick it up.
03:17 - Tom Kirkham
For those of you who don't know about Kirkham Iron Tech or Iron Tech Security, we have 2 divisions. One of them, which is the 20-plus-year-old part of it, is what's known in the business as a managed services provider, right? It's basically an outsourced IT staff for small to medium-sized businesses. And actually we're getting larger and larger businesses all the time because not only is it very cost-effective to outsource your IT, even if you've got hundreds of people, a good MSP is going to have very, very expensive tools to properly manage that environment. So, you know, it's really great if you've got just a couple of IT people, but you've got 500 people to support, you'll see those environments outsource a lot.
And those IT people just are there kind of as a symphony conductor, you know, Whether they're outsourcing help desk or cyber security now Iron tech Security is a managed security services provider Much the same thing but the focus is completely on providing enterprise-grade cyber security defenses and training and the pen testing, vulnerability assessments and all of that.
So you, you, you can get your company, you understand where your company is today and what you need to do to really ramp up the protection for, you know, really all the stakeholders in the company. You know, it could be your clients or customers, but it's also your employees. For many of you, it could be your community, your state, you know. There are a lot of different moving pieces there and making your company and yourself safe is critical to the longevity of the company. I wanted to write the book not for my peers or other InfoSec specialists, but for that small business owner or medium-sized business president, CEO, or whatever and put it in real-world terms, and I figured the best way to do that was to wrap a fictional story around it.
But what I'm really proud of in the book is it does a really good job of illustrating the failure in management and leadership that led to the entire attack. And that's usually what it is. And I hate to say it like that, but hoping it doesn't happen to you or your company is not a strategy. And good leaders always have a strategy. They understand their risk. It's like buying insurance, Many businesses have liability insurance, errors and omissions, medical malpractice insurance, and on and on and on.
Of course, you got building and everything else. But that just seems like just a normal business management decision. You know, you're being prudent. If the worst thing happens, at least insurance will help make us whole. But the vast majority of small business people don't know where to go to get the best cyber security stuff and you really should go to a specialist and it is outside the scope of IT. Yeah, it's a different skill set, it's a different experience, and It's actually a different objective. My goal is to not make everyone who reads it a cybersecurity expert.
The point of the book, when you're the leader of the organization, is getting a high enough level view to know what you need to do, you know, to buy the best-of-breed tools to implement best-of-breed administrative controls or procedures and policies around password complexity requirements and putting in cybersecurity awareness training and then you're fulfilling your obligation to be a leader in the company. But the key critical thing to it is just impressing upon people the sheer depth of the problem. These are all industry standards. It's not just me saying you need to put these things in place.
The White House says it's part of the NIST cybersecurity framework, National Institute of Standards and Technologies. Those of us in the business understand that these are just best practices. And it's the cost of doing business these days. So by me writing the book and coming on your podcast and speaking engagements and things like that, My role is to educate as many people as I possibly can.
08:06 - Gresham Harkless
I definitely appreciate you obviously coming on the show, but definitely all the work that you did. I love that you were able to kind of arm the people with that information. So would you think that, I call it the secret sauce, the thing you feel either sets you or the organization apart and makes it unique? Is it your ability? And I'm thinking of like ASAP's fables of being able to kind of take sometimes, you know, those lessons, those tools, that information to be able to kind of simplify so that everybody can understand. Do you feel like that's something that, definitely in this book, but other aspects of things that you do, do you feel like that's what sets you apart and makes you unique?
08:39 - Tom Kirkham
Yeah, absolutely. We frequently, almost constantly, walk into a prospect, a new environment, or even existing clients, because we do periodic business reviews not only does technology change, but cybersecurity changes more and faster and there could be a new threat this afternoon that's a new threat actor and all of that. But in these meetings with prospects and clients, our job is to explain it in such a manner that they can understand. And okay, this isn't going to be, I get why we need it now, or I get how it's gonna be implemented. I understand the impacts on the business and what risk we're shrinking down, right? You always wanna minimize risk to the organization.
And if we just went in there, or if I had done this with the book, and it was just a dry technical discussion of implementing these technical controls, these administrative controls, and these physical controls, and talk about the benefits and all of that, it wouldn't have been as nearly as effective and it really wouldn't have, well it certainly wouldn't have illustrated the management and leadership component of it as well to impress upon them the need to make this positive decision for their organization.
10:07 - Gresham Harkless
Yeah, absolutely. And you start to see when you do and are creating leaders, I always feel like the best leaders are at that ability to not just say do what I say, but actually help to empower and help people to understand. As you mentioned that capital, that stakeholder capitalism is huge because there are so many people that are involved and you have to be able to empower leaders to be able to think about all the different things that are going on within an organization.
So I think that's huge. And that might be like your CEO nugget. Do you have a CEO hack, which is a little bit more like something from your book, or could be something that you feel makes you more effective and efficient that we can kind of take away from your book?
10:45 - Tom Kirkham
Your role and your responsibility is to set the vision and the overall strategy, understand, oh, there's a market opportunity here, is to investigate it. And one of the things that I do is when I am truly confident that we're breaking into a new market. And it's something no one else is doing. It's unique, it's risky. You gotta be a risk-taker, or else you're not going to be a good leader, right? Imagination, and creativity are all part of it. You know, a lot of business owners are technicians, you know, they were accountants who worked for an accounting firm and then decided to hang their shingle out.
Well, now that all of a sudden you've got to start wearing different hats and you've got, one of those is to look at the overall strategy. What are, What's going to be coming down the road 5 years down the road? If everyone doesn't share your vision, no amount of commanding is going to make it a successful launch into a new endeavor. You know, everyone's not swimming in the same direction or flying in the same formation. I guess that's a nugget. But, yeah, yeah. I think that, and it all works together with servant leadership and all of that.
12:00 - Gresham Harkless
Absolutely. I think you really are able to drill down deep and understand what success and winning mean for each individual person and be able to kind of dial in so that that ties into the overall vision that you have.
12:12 - Tom Kirkham
The real key is that is this somebody that everyone in the organization is going to enjoy working with and it's going to make everyone better at their job and their personal lives and their professional lives you know and if you if you're running a business and there's a lot of drama around the office you need to question what kind of culture are you setting? You know, that's the, I would say in my belief that that's, that's not a very productive environment and you're costing your company a lot of money.
12:44 - Gresham Harkless
Yeah, absolutely. And I think that I, I love that you said that because I think sometimes when you're thinking I'm bringing on the summer interns, so it's going to be for a few months and then they're going to be gone, and go back to school, whatever it might be. But I think if you start to look at that force multiplier, for lack of a better term, you start to see the impact that that person, whether it be the intern, whether it be the new person that's going to handle accounts or whatever that title might be, at the end of the day, that impact, just like we talked about from a cybersecurity standpoint, is going to carry on, not just from that 3 months, it's going to carry on and on and on. So you have to be so aware and I think very diligent about who you're bringing into that culture because it will stay with that culture beyond sometimes even when that person's there.
13:27 -Tom Kirkham
Yeah, absolutely. And sometimes they come in as an intern and they think they want to do something else, maybe with a publicly traded company, you know, be a small fish in a big pond or whatever the stability, so to speak, whatever that means these days. And then they discover that not only do they really enjoy certain aspects of our company, but then they go, I want to do professional development here and contribute to the culture because I really enjoy working here. It's not unusual for a Fortune 500 company here in town to pick up somebody and hire them away from us and then 2 or 3 years later, they come back to us.
And there's one in particularly local that it seems like it's like a door going there and a door coming back. In fact, the first time I hired somebody from them was over 30 years ago, and he works for us today. So it's just a really interesting deal. But I'm happy for them. If that's part of their goals in life, it doesn't change our relationship. It impacts us when they leave, but that happens. That happens in life. My objective is to make sure that we do everything we can as a company to address whatever goal or objective, whatever they're missing in our company, is there something we can do about that?
15:09 - Gresham Harkless
You know? Tom, truly appreciate that definition and perspective. And of course, I appreciate your time even more. So what I wanted to do now is pass you the mic, so to speak, just to see if there's anything additional that you can let our readers and listeners know. And of course, how best people can get a copy of the book, and find out about all the awesome things you and your team are working on as well.
15:26 -Tom Kirkham
It's on Amazon. You can search my name or cyber pandemic, and it'll take you right to it. You can find me on LinkedIn and all that stuff. But my, company is irontechsecurity.com. I have a website where, you know, it's tomcurcom.com where we promote the book and speaking engagements. If anyone's interested in having me speak in front of their organization, just reach out with that and we can see what we can do for you. Same thing with webinars. You know, if you're part of a society or, you know, we deal with engineering societies, accounting societies, bar associations. Nice.
16:05 - Gresham Harkless
I absolutely love that. Of course, we're going to have the links and information to show notes so that everybody can reach out and connect with you. Of course, get a copy of the book as well too. And I hope you have a phenomenal rest of the day.
16:14 - Tom Kirkham
Alrighty. Thank you very much. And it was my pleasure being here. Really is.
16:18 - Outro
Thank you for listening to the I AM CEO Podcast powered by Blue 16 Media. Tune in next time and visit us at iamceo.co I AM CEO is not just a phrase, it's a community. Be sure to follow us on social media and subscribe to our podcast on iTunes Google Play and everywhere you listen to podcasts, SUBSCRIBE, and leave us a five-star rating grab CEO gear at www.ceogear.co. This has been the I AM CEO Podcast with Gresham Harkless. Thank you for listening.
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