IAM1089- Prolific Trademark Filer Practices Before Several Courts
Podcast Interview with William Scott Goldman
William Scott Goldman is the founding member of Goldman Law Group, representing creative business clients, both established and early-stage, throughout the U.S. and internationally. Mr. Goldman received an LL.M. in Patent and Intellectual Property Law from George Washington University and is licensed to practice before several courts. One of the world's most prolific trademark filers, he's perennially ranked ‘Top-10' at the USPTO now with over 11,000 pending applications and registrations. Having written the book on Branding Law, he is also a frequent lecturer, guest speaker, media commentator, and author on various legal subjects. Clients appreciate his creative insights based on almost 30 years. of practical experience, quick response times, and reasonable flat-fee billing.
- CEO Hack: Branding
- CEO Nugget: It's all about brand
- CEO Defined: Assuming ultimate responsibility
Website: https://www.goldmanlawgroup.com/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/william-scott-goldman/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/goldmanlawgroup
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/brandinglaw/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/branding_lawyer
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Transcription
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00:24 – Intro
Are you ready to hear business stories and learn effective ways to build relationships, generate sales, and level up your business from awesome CEOs, entrepreneurs, and founders without listening to a long, long, long interview? If so, you've come to the right place. Gresh values your time and is ready to share with you the valuable info you're in search of. This is the I AM CEO podcast.
00:51 – Gresham Harkless
Hello. Hello. Hello. This is Gresh from the I AM CEO podcast, and I have a very special guest on the show today. I have William Scott Goldman of Goldman Law Group. William, it's great to have you on the show.
01:02 – William Scott Goldman
Yes. Thanks for having me, Gresh.
01:04 – Gresham Harkless
Super excited to have you on. Before we jumped into the interview, I wanted to read a little bit more about William so you could hear about all the awesome things that he's doing. William Scott Goldman is the managing attorney and founding member of Goldman Law Group, representing creative business clients, both established in early stages throughout the US and internationally. William received an LLM and patent in intellectual property law from George Washington parentally ranked top ten at the USPTO, now with over eleven thousand pending applications and registrations.
Having written a book on branding law, he is also a frequent lecturer, guest speaker, media commenter, and author on various legal subjects. Clients appreciate his creative insights based on almost thirty years of practical experience, quiet response quick response times, and quiet and reasonable flat fee billing. And also, let me add, that he's a contributor to our blog site as well. So William, truly appreciate you for taking some time out. Are you ready to speak to the I AM CEO community?
[restrict paid=”true”]
02:12 – William Scott Goldman
Most definitely.
02:13 – Gresham Harkless
Awesome. Well, let's do it then. So to kick everything off, I wanted to rewind the clock a little bit and hear a little bit more about how you guys started, what I call your CEO story.
02:22 – William Scott Goldman
Sure. Well, representing innovation, it's both our mantra and mission statement. It simply signifies our firm's disruptive approach toward providing cutting-edge legal solutions to create a business client in all fifty states and worldwide. Many years ago, we recognized the need for a new type of law firm, start-up clients. And so we set out to create a brand new business model, essentially bridging the gap between the nonlawyer legal service provider companies out there and the more traditional law firm structure.
Showing hourly billing in, favor of predictable flat fee payment is appreciated by bootstrapping founders and entrepreneurs, limiting our practice areas to those legal fields most relevant to emerging companies, helps keep overhead costs down, allowing us to scale the business, and offering attorney access twenty-four hours a day, seven days a week is virtually unheard of in the industry, enabling us to better serve early stage business clients everywhere.
03:21 – Gresham Harkless
Nice. Well, I appreciate that, and it's so interesting that I was reading your bios. You have that kind of creativity in your DNA as you also have that with the clients that you work with. So it's so important, I guess, probably to make sure that you're connected with your clients by making sure you're being cutting edge and having that, quality service that you're providing.
03:42 – William Scott Goldman
Indeed. It works both ways. Representing innovation is sort of a double meaning. Our approach is very innovative, and the attorneys with our firm are creative, and they're entrepreneurs in their own right. And those are the types of clients that we represent and it enables us to connect and, understand that client base so all the better.
04:05 – Gresham Harkless
Yeah. Absolutely. It's so important to practice what you preach, so to speak. So it's great to hear that you've been able to kinda do that, within your business and, of course, help so many, creative entrepreneurs, and business clients, and I imagine people make an impact on their rights as well too. So, I know you touched on it a little bit, when you just talked a little bit more about your story, and I did as well with your bio. Could you take us through a little bit more on how you work with your clients and what that process looks like?
04:32 – William Scott Goldman
Sure. Our clients come from all over, and it's a very busy work day. You know, it starts around, 10:00 or so in the AM East Coast time. We're based in Washington, DC. And so we'll hear from our clients in New York and DC. Of course, as the day goes on, we start, hearing from other clients out in the Midwest. And then toward the afternoon hours, we're getting emails and phone calls from our clients on the West Coast.
And then from there, by early evening, we'll hear from clients in Europe and, even as far out as Australia, and New Zealand by 10:00 at night. It's already morning hours in Asia, so then we're talking with our clients in China, Japan, and pretty much everywhere on that side of the world. So, yeah, it's quite busy but quite rewarding, working some full days and, covering the gamut whether it's the US or worldwide.
05:37 – Gresham Harkless
Yeah. Absolutely. A full day to say the least. It sounds like it's jam-packed, but, it's great to hear you're able to work with clients literally, it sounds like, everywhere and to be able to provide that experience and that expertise that they have because I imagine that innovation doesn't, like, have boundaries across, like, state lines or country lines, and people need that help regardless of what where they are.
06:00 – William Scott Goldman
Exactly. It's truly a global economy. It's a term that people throw around, here and there pretty regularly. But, in the case of IP law and entrepreneurship, creative minds never sleep, and, we're here to serve those types of clients twenty-four-seven.
06:21 – Gresham Harkless
Yeah. Absolutely. And I imagine that people are creating, especially from a trademark standpoint, people are creating, like, those creative product services and ideas, and it's so important that they're able to protect themselves to some degree to make sure that their innovation and their creativity is, able to make the impact and and and desire that they hope to have.
06:43 – William Scott Goldman
Oh, exactly. That's the backbone of any successful business. The creative aspects, intellectual property, and that's what we're here for, to safeguard, people's interventions and ideas. And that's how they can monetize and, succeed from there.
07:01 – Gresham Harkless
Yeah. It provides that opportunity to continue to grow and to innovate even more when you know that the creativity that you have is protected. So I love that you're able to do that. And so, what would you consider to be what I like to call your secret sauce? And this could be for yourself, for the business, or a combination of both. But what do you feel sets you apart and makes you unique?
07:21 – William Scott Goldman
Good question. As mentioned earlier, we're a one-of-a-kind business and branding IP law firm, and we serve the needs of innovators, through a highly innovative approach towards the delivery of legal services. We have a groundbreaking new business model for the first century if you will. Nowhere else will you find lawyers available every hour of the day, serving clients worldwide every day of the year. So I think that does set us apart.
07:45 – Gresham Harkless
Yeah. Absolutely. When you have that, for lack of a better term, you wanna make sure that you're able to provide that service depending on, as you said, as you showed so well, like, the different time zones and different locations, but I think, I guess they the the the intellectual property never sleeps, so having that opportunity to provide that, likewise service is is so huge.
08:07 – William Scott Goldman
Exactly. Very true. That's why we like to have that, availability, just because not only is it geographic in scope, but even clients in the US will have people, say it's two, or three in the morning here on the East Coast. And, of course, it's midafternoon overseas, but, you may have a client with an inspiration, out in New York or the Midwest, Texas, or, California. They may contact us at 2 AM with some fantastic new inspiration, and, we're there for them. So, certainly, the mind doesn't stop and, we're here to serve that need.
08:57 – Gresham Harkless
Yeah. Absolutely. Gotta be there where the mind and the innovation are happening. So I love that you all are doing that, and, of course, that innovation in the business model as well too because I think that's where truly phenomenal things happen at the intersection of that, that creativity and that innovation. So I'm glad you're at the forefront of that as well. So, I wanted to, switch gears a little bit, and I want to ask you for what I call a CEO hack. So this could be like an app, a book, or a habit that you have, but what's something that makes you more effective and efficient?
09:27 – William Scott Goldman
Perhaps it's a bit of shameless self-promotion right here, but fifteen or maybe twenty years ago, I started to develop the field of branding law, publishing the only legal case book, several years ago with the second edition due for release later this year. Viewing everything through the prism of branding law, provides a whole different perspective for our creative client base, whether it's corporate branding or personal branding. And it essentially shapes everything we do as a one-of-a-kind business and branding IP law firm.
09:59 – Gresham Harkless
I wanted to ask you now for what I call a CEO nugget. So this could be a word of wisdom or a piece of advice. It could be something from your book, but it might be something you would tell a client or if you have to do a time machine, you would tell your younger business self.
10:12 – William Scott Goldman
Well, tying in with what we were just discussing and staying on the topic of branding law, fits our client base perfectly, particularly the graphic designers, the entertainers, the ad agencies, and anybody media savvy and connected with PR, social influence in the twenty-four-hour news cycle. Because when you think about it, whether you're in the next Apple, Tesla, Steve Jobs, or Elon Musk, late twentieth-century and early twenty-first-century life is all about the brand.
10:42 – Gresham Harkless
Yeah. Absolutely. And so I wanted to ask you now my absolute favorite question, which is the definition of what it means to be a CEO. And we're hoping to have different quote-unquote CEOs on the show. So, William, what does being a CEO mean to you?
10:54 – William Scott Goldman
Well, to me, I think it means assuming ultimate responsibility from developing and even approving marketing strategies to ensuring continuous innovation and growth. It's the CEO's job to delegate effectively, often making those all-important hiring decisions, whether it's the full-time employees or outside service providers. Not only that but overseeing all touch points for both existing and future clients. It's the CEO's job to protect and build the company's brand as clients' experience and value proposition, and results are achieved through that, first and foremost.
And I would say too, that providing long-term vision and motivation to others are key roles of the CEO, really vital to a thriving organization. What else? Troubleshooting, and resolving any internal or client-facing issues promptly and efficiently, must be considered too. And then, of course, you have the more mundane aspects, the essential billing, bookkeeping, accounting, payroll tax, and regulatory compliance issues that keep a business running. So at the end of the day, the CEO must effectively manage those, the CEOs, the organization's public face, and behind the scenes, its heart and soul.
12:20 – Gresham Harkless
William, truly appreciate that definition, and I appreciate your time even more. What I wanted to do is just pass you the mic, so to speak, just to see if there's anything additional that you can let our readers and listeners know and, of course, how best they can get a hold of you and find out about all the awesome things that you're working on.
12:36 – William Scott Goldman
Absolutely. Yeah. Well, getting back to the CEO golden nugget question from before, one of my favorite quotes or, thinkers is Peter Drucker, the famous management consultant and author. And he once explained that business success is based on marketing plus innovation, and that really, informs everything that we do. And applying this concept firsthand, I've since learned that ongoing innovation should be the defining organizational theme. And by staying ahead of the curve and creating a distinctive niche in the marketplace, that alone should generate competitive advantage while better serving the needs of clients and prospective clients, effectively marketing one's unique selling proposition while always underpromising and overdelivering produces exponential results.
In other words, the effective organization is always exceeding expectations with a very high-touch client experience that generates repeat business and future referrals, of course, minimizing acquisition costs. At the same time, there should be a keen institutional focus on promoting underlying brand values both internally and externally to create a positive culture fueling continued growth.
13:56 – Gresham Harkless
Yeah. Absolutely. I love that piece of that quote. And just again, the expense the the understanding the full lay of the land of exactly what it is that you're doing as a leader, and being able to have that marketing innovation go hand in hand is huge. So I appreciate you, for sharing that. And for people who wanna get a hold of you and, of course, get a copy of the book, what's the best way for them to do that?
14:19 – William Scott Goldman
Oh, sure. The quickest way is by email. There's also a contact form on our firm's website, and that would be www.goldmanlawgroup.com.
14:37 – Gresham Harkless
Awesome. Awesome. Awesome. And we'll have the links and information in the show notes as well too so that everybody can follow up with you. But we truly appreciate you for taking some time out today. Of course, appreciate you for creating that lane that important and expansive in the ways that it affects businesses and organizations and the people within them as well. So thank you so much for being a trailblazer and reminding us of how important that is, and I hope you have a phenomenal rest of the day.
15:02 – Outro
Thank you for listening to the I AM CEO Podcast powered by Blue 16 Media. Tune in next time and visit us at iamceo.co I AM CEO is not just a phrase, it's a community. Be sure to follow us on social media and subscribe to our podcast on iTunes Google Play and everywhere you listen to podcasts, SUBSCRIBE, and leave us a five-star rating grab CEO gear at www.ceogear.co. This has been the I AM CEO Podcast with Gresham Harkless. Thank you for listening.
[00:00:24.30] - Intro
Are you ready to hear business stories and learn effective ways to build relationships, generate sales, and level up your business from awesome CEOs, entrepreneurs, and founders without listening to a long, long, long interview? If so, you've come to the right place. Gresh values your time and is ready to share with you the valuable info you're in search of. This is the I AM CEO podcast.
[00:00:51.89] - Gresham Harkless
Hello. Hello. Hello. This is Gresh from the I AM CEO podcast, and I have a very special guest on the show today. I have William Scott Goldman of Goldman Law Group. William, it's great to have you on the show.
[00:01:02.10] - William Scott Goldman
Yes. Thanks for having me, Gresh.
[00:01:04.50] - Gresham Harkless
Super excited to have you on. Before we jumped into the interview, I wanted to read a little bit more about William so you could hear about all the awesome things that he's doing. William Scott Goldman is the managing attorney and founding member of Goldman Law Group, representing creative business clients, both established in early stages throughout the US and internationally. William received an LLM and patent in intellectual property law from George Washington parentally ranked top ten at the USPTO, now with over eleven thousand pending applications and registrations.
Having written a book on branding law, he is also a frequent lecturer, guest speaker, media commenter, and author on various legal subjects. Clients appreciate his creative insights based on almost thirty years of practical experience, quiet response quick response times, and quiet and reasonable flat fee billing. And also, let me add, that he's a contributor to our blog site as well. So William, truly appreciate you for taking some time out. Are you ready to speak to the I AM CEO community?
[00:02:12.30] - William Scott Goldman
Most definitely.
[00:02:13.59] - Gresham Harkless
Awesome. Well, let's do it then. So to kick everything off, I wanted to rewind the clock a little bit and hear a little bit more about how you guys started, what I call your CEO story.
[00:02:22.59] - William Scott Goldman
Sure. Well, representing innovation, it's both our mantra and mission statement. It simply signifies our firm's disruptive approach toward providing cutting-edge legal solutions to create a business client in all fifty states and worldwide. Many years ago, we recognized the need for a new type of law firm, start-up clients. And so we set out to create a brand new business model, essentially bridging the gap between the nonlawyer legal service provider companies out there and the more traditional law firm structure.
Showing hourly billing in, favor of predictable flat fee payment is appreciated by bootstrapping founders and entrepreneurs, limiting our practice areas to those legal fields most relevant to emerging companies, helps keep overhead costs down, allowing us to scale the business, and offering attorney access twenty-four hours a day, seven days a week is virtually unheard of in the industry, enabling us to better serve early stage business clients everywhere.
[00:03:21.69] - Gresham Harkless
Nice. Well, I appreciate that, and it's so interesting that I was reading your bios. You have that kind of creativity in your DNA as you also have that with the clients that you work with. So it's so important, I guess, probably to make sure that you're connected with your clients by making sure you're being cutting edge and having that, quality service that you're providing.
[00:03:42.69] - William Scott Goldman
Indeed. It works both ways. Representing innovation is sort of a double meaning. Our approach is very innovative, and the attorneys with our firm are creative, and they're entrepreneurs in their own right. And those are the types of clients that we represent and it enables us to connect and, understand that client base so all the better.
[00:04:05.80] - Gresham Harkless
Yeah. Absolutely. It's so important to practice what you preach, so to speak. So it's great to hear that you've been able to kinda do that, within your business and, of course, help so many, creative entrepreneurs, and business clients, and I imagine people make an impact on their rights as well too. So, I know you touched on it a little bit, when you just talked a little bit more about your story, and I did as well with your bio. Could you take us through a little bit more on how you work with your clients and what that process looks like?
[00:04:32.00] - William Scott Goldman
Sure. Our clients come from all over, and it's a very busy work day. You know, it starts around, 10:00 or so in the AM East Coast time. We're based in Washington, DC. And so we'll hear from our clients in New York and DC. Of course, as the day goes on, we start, hearing from other clients out in the Midwest. And then toward the afternoon hours, we're getting emails and phone calls from our clients on the West Coast.
And then from there, by early evening, we'll hear from clients in Europe and, even as far out as Australia, and New Zealand by 10:00 at night. It's already morning hours in Asia, so then we're talking with our clients in China, Japan, and pretty much everywhere on that side of the world. So, yeah, it's quite busy but quite rewarding, working some full days and, covering the gamut whether it's the US or worldwide.
[00:05:37.89] - Gresham Harkless
Yeah. Absolutely. A full day to say the least. It sounds like it's jam-packed, but, it's great to hear you're able to work with clients literally, it sounds like, everywhere and to be able to provide that experience and that expertise that they have because I imagine that innovation doesn't, like, have boundaries across, like, state lines or country lines, and people need that help regardless of what where they are.
[00:06:00.60] - William Scott Goldman
Exactly. It's truly a global economy. It's a term that people throw around, here and there pretty regularly. But, in the case of IP law and entrepreneurship, creative minds never sleep, and, we're here to serve those types of clients twenty-four-seven.
[00:06:21.50] - Gresham Harkless
Yeah. Absolutely. And I imagine that people are creating, especially from a trademark standpoint, people are creating, like, those creative product services and ideas, and it's so important that they're able to protect themselves to some degree to make sure that their innovation and their creativity is, able to make the impact and and and desire that they hope to have.
[00:06:43.80] - William Scott Goldman
Oh, exactly. That's the backbone of any successful business. The creative aspects, intellectual property, and that's what we're here for, to safeguard, people's interventions and ideas. And that's how they can monetize and, succeed from there.
[00:07:01.60] - Gresham Harkless
Yeah. It provides that opportunity to continue to grow and to innovate even more when you know that the creativity that you have is protected. So I love that you're able to do that. And so, what would you consider to be what I like to call your secret sauce? And this could be for yourself, for the business, or a combination of both. But what do you feel sets you apart and makes you unique?
[00:07:21.50] - William Scott Goldman
Good question. As mentioned earlier, we're a one-of-a-kind business and branding IP law firm, and we serve the needs of innovators, through a highly innovative approach towards the delivery of legal services. We have a groundbreaking new business model for the first century if you will. Nowhere else will you find lawyers available every hour of the day, serving clients worldwide every day of the year. So I think that does set us apart.
[00:07:45.30] - Gresham Harkless
Yeah. Absolutely. When you have that, for lack of a better term, you wanna make sure that you're able to provide that service depending on, as you said, as you showed so well, like, the different time zones and different locations, but I think, I guess they the the the intellectual property never sleeps, so having that opportunity to provide that, likewise service is is so huge.
[00:08:07.30] - William Scott Goldman
Exactly. Very true. That's why we like to have that, availability, just because not only is it geographic in scope, but even clients in the US will have people, say it's two, or three in the morning here on the East Coast. And, of course, it's midafternoon overseas, but, you may have a client with an inspiration, out in New York or the Midwest, Texas, or, California. They may contact us at 2 AM with some fantastic new inspiration, and, we're there for them. So, certainly, the mind doesn't stop and, we're here to serve that need.
[00:08:57.29] - Gresham Harkless
Yeah. Absolutely. Gotta be there where the mind and the innovation are happening. So I love that you all are doing that, and, of course, that innovation in the business model as well too because I think that's where truly phenomenal things happen at the intersection of that, that creativity and that innovation. So I'm glad you're at the forefront of that as well. So, I wanted to, switch gears a little bit, and I want to ask you for what I call a CEO hack. So this could be like an app, a book, or a habit that you have, but what's something that makes you more effective and efficient?
[00:09:27.89] - William Scott Goldman
Perhaps it's a bit of shameless self-promotion right here, but fifteen or maybe twenty years ago, I started to develop the field of branding law, publishing the only legal case book, several years ago with the second edition due for release later this year. Viewing everything through the prism of branding law, provides a whole different perspective for our creative client base, whether it's corporate branding or personal branding. And it essentially shapes everything we do as a one-of-a-kind business and branding IP law firm.
[00:09:59.10] - Gresham Harkless
I wanted to ask you now for what I call a CEO nugget. So this could be a word of wisdom or a piece of advice. It could be something from your book, but it might be something you would tell a client or if you have to do a time machine, you would tell your younger business self.
[00:10:12.89] - William Scott Goldman
Well, tying in with what we were just discussing and staying on the topic of branding law, fits our client base perfectly, particularly the graphic designers, the entertainers, the ad agencies, and anybody media savvy and connected with PR, social influence in the twenty-four-hour news cycle. Because when you think about it, whether you're in the next Apple, Tesla, Steve Jobs, or Elon Musk, late twentieth-century and early twenty-first-century life is all about the brand.
[00:10:42.39] - Gresham Harkless
Yeah. Absolutely. And so I wanted to ask you now my absolute favorite question, which is the definition of what it means to be a CEO. And we're hoping to have different quote-unquote CEOs on the show. So, William, what does being a CEO mean to you?
[00:10:54.79] - William Scott Goldman
Well, to me, I think it means assuming ultimate responsibility from developing and even approving marketing strategies to ensuring continuous innovation and growth. It's the CEO's job to delegate effectively, often making those all-important hiring decisions, whether it's the full-time employees or outside service providers. Not only that but overseeing all touch points for both existing and future clients. It's the CEO's job to protect and build the company's brand as clients' experience and value proposition, and results are achieved through that, first and foremost.
And I would say too, that providing long-term vision and motivation to others are key roles of the CEO, really vital to a thriving organization. What else? Troubleshooting, and resolving any internal or client-facing issues promptly and efficiently, must be considered too. And then, of course, you have the more mundane aspects, the essential billing, bookkeeping, accounting, payroll tax, and regulatory compliance issues that keep a business running. So at the end of the day, the CEO must effectively manage those, the CEOs, the organization's public face, and behind the scenes, its heart and soul.
[00:12:20.89] - Gresham Harkless
William, truly appreciate that definition, and I appreciate your time even more. What I wanted to do is just pass you the mic, so to speak, just to see if there's anything additional that you can let our readers and listeners know and, of course, how best they can get a hold of you and find out about all the awesome things that you're working on.
[00:12:36.29] - William Scott Goldman
Absolutely. Yeah. Well, getting back to the CEO golden nugget question from before, one of my favorite quotes or, thinkers is Peter Drucker, the famous management consultant and author. And he once explained that business success is based on marketing plus innovation, and that really, informs everything that we do. And applying this concept firsthand, I've since learned that ongoing innovation should be the defining organizational theme. And by staying ahead of the curve and creating a distinctive niche in the marketplace, that alone should generate competitive advantage while better serving the needs of clients and prospective clients, effectively marketing one's unique selling proposition while always underpromising and overdelivering produces exponential results.
In other words, the effective organization is always exceeding expectations with a very high-touch client experience that generates repeat business and future referrals, of course, minimizing acquisition costs. At the same time, there should be a keen institutional focus on promoting underlying brand values both internally and externally to create a positive culture fueling continued growth.
[00:13:56.20] - Gresham Harkless
Yeah. Absolutely. I love that piece of that quote. And just again, the expense the the understanding the full lay of the land of exactly what it is that you're doing as a leader, and being able to have that marketing innovation go hand in hand is huge. So I appreciate you, for sharing that. And for people who wanna get a hold of you and, of course, get a copy of the book, what's the best way for them to do that?
[00:14:19.20] - William Scott Goldman
Oh, sure. The quickest way is by email. There's also a contact form on our firm's website, and that would be www.goldmanlawgroup.com.
[00:14:37.79] - Gresham Harkless
Awesome. Awesome. Awesome. And we'll have the links and information in the show notes as well too so that everybody can follow up with you. But we truly appreciate you for taking some time out today. Of course, appreciate you for creating that lane that important and expansive in the ways that it affects businesses and organizations and the people within them as well. So thank you so much for being a trailblazer and reminding us of how important that is, and I hope you have a phenomenal rest of the day.
[00:15:02 - Outro
Thank you for listening to the I AM CEO Podcast powered by Blue 16 Media. Tune in next time and visit us at iamceo.co I AM CEO is not just a phrase, it's a community. Be sure to follow us on social media and subscribe to our podcast on iTunes Google Play and everywhere you listen to podcasts, SUBSCRIBE, and leave us a five-star rating grab CEO gear at www.ceogear.co. This has been the I AM CEO Podcast with Gresham Harkless. Thank you for listening.
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